The roots of our Hellenic Language

[Prokomenos]

THE HELLENIC LANGUAGE

In this webpage of ours we'll present you with the latest evidence proving the ancestry of Hellenic language (as a consequence that the alphabet IS NOT a Phoenician invention) as well as some of its unknown features (such as i.e. that there is a great similarity of ancient Greek with a) the language of the Hawaii Islands inhabitants and b) the language of Ketsua - inhabitants of the Peruvian Andes).

The most important of the facts that prove the ancestry of the Hellenic language over the rest,
are the following :

• the discovery of the linear writings A' and B' by A. EVANS at Crete in 1947 and the decryption of linear B' in 1952..
• the discovery of the Phaestus Disk in pressed-type iconographic writing system.
• the discovery of a wooden plate inscribed with linear A' at the Dispilio of Kastoria which currently constitutes the most ancient sample of writing in the world.

The Hellenic language is the most perfect human achievement in the linguistic field. And this, of course, is not incidental. Because 'the thought of a people is perhaps more directly expressed in the structure of language than in any other of his creations' (Kitto). This language, therefore, is the creation of people with superior thought and mental consistency. The qualities characterizing the language of the Hellenes, also characterize their being. Proof is that the same qualities (clarity, providence, power, expressional wealth etc) are found in their mental and artistic creations.

The inevitable conclusion is that the Greek language wasn't brought by some semi-savage tribe from its 'northern mountains' or 'the northern plains'. (Note of "UHH" - as the supporters of the indoeuropean origin of the Greek language claim-). It existed ab initio and developed in the same place for thousands of years. Its an evolution product of millennia. And the language that the Achaeans spoke or wrote was the continuation of the Pelasgian language and writing. This language, initially (Protohellenic) became diversified with the spread of Aegeans (Protohellenes) in vast (and distant from the metropolis) regions.
Thus arose the multiple Greek dialects and the relative to it languages of other nations (Iapetic homoglossy=Hellenic originated languages). As far as the writing is concerned, Sleeman and Evans proved that it was in use at the Aegean at least from 2,500 B.C. and the latest researches (inscriptions at Ithaca's Pilakata and Dispilio of Kastoria) raised it to the sixth millenium (5,250 BC).

Symbols - letters from protocycladit jar of Milos
(midle of 3rd milenium b.C.).
You can see "X" and "N" letters of the Greek Alfabet

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[Ellinas]

The Phoenician fairy tale collapsed a long ago, with proof. They are still many so-called serious scientists who support it tho (the same who support the ridiculous Indo-european theory).

[Apollyon]

I say start writing foreign words in order to prove the hellenic origin of them

" <<I - english , Io - italian , Ego - hellenic"
" << will - english , voulisis - hellenic>>"
"<< know - english , konx - hellenic - an ancient Doric type>>"

people add words ...

[really]

Socrates in one of his dialogues (I think it was Erythro) mentions that the roots of some Greek words came from another older language. It was pretty interesting because I did not know that there were older languages than the Greek language.

[Apollyon]

Originally Posted by really
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Socrates in one of his dialogues (I think it was Erythro) mentions that the roots of some Greek words came from another older language. It was pretty interesting because I did not know that there were older languages than the Greek language.

I am curious about what u wrote....
i'm gonna check it out

[really]

Yes, it is a very good dialogue because Socrates explained the epitomology of the Greek language. He did not specify which was the country from which the older language is. If I find back the correct title of the dialogue, I am going to post here. It was an astounding discovery for me when I read what he said.

By the way, Socrates is my hero. :D

[antonio]

Originally Posted by Apollyon
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I say start writing foreign words in order to prove the hellenic origin of them

" <<I - english , Io - italian , Ego - hellenic"
" << will - english , voulisis - hellenic>>"
"<< know - english , konx - hellenic - an ancient Doric type>>"

people add words ...

5% of English words have their origin in Greek. Quite a few are, of course, scientific terms.
But, you must be careful before assuming a foreign word is of hellenic origin. Sometimes foreign words are very similar to Greek words because they both come from the same Indo-european root word.

[really]

Apollyon, the dialogue is Cratylus. Enjoy reading it.

[Mr. Verenidou]

ax Greek ! hurrah - Greek is classified in the gropu of Indo-European Language Families. Whilst Latin, Germenic and Slavic langauges resemble eachother , Greek is put into a box with Armenian and Albanian. Of these 3 languages have no sister.

Greek has borrowed many words from the languages spoken around, i.e, Persian, Arabic, Latin, Avestan, Asyrrian...Most of the Linguists make up a language called Indo-European that disappeared milleniums ago and that the languages spoken in Europe can be associated to this language in terms of glossaries. Farsi, the official language of Iran, is still spoen in the area where Indo-European was spoken and today, Greek and Farsi have many similarities, both in glossary and grammer. There are some ancient etymos from Egyption, Hatti, Avestan. But Greek language contributed more than it borrowed. it's hard anyway, hard to learn. the grammer looks like German and the pronounciation sounds latin. there are many Greek words in Turkish as well.

[half greek]

The Truth must be told

History should be rewritten

All false myths will now fall

Fact 1: The Alphabet is a Hellenic invention



Why certain historians made such a gross mistake?

"Αταλαίπωρος τοις πολλοις η ζήτησις της αληθείας και επί τα έτοιμα μάλλον τρέπονται" (Thucidedes 1.20,3)

Every Phoenician advocate is of course referring, without examining history from a broader perspective, to the well known story of Herodotus regarding the transfer of the letters of the alphabet from Cadmus and the Phoenicians to Hellas (Terpsichore, 58). In particular in that single part Herodotus mentions " The Phoenicians, I think, brought teachings to the Greeks and the letters they (Phoenicians) had before them (Greeks)".

Many historians have used the above passage as unquestionable dogma and it is bizarre how academics do not examine opposing views, so prevalent in ancient literature. To analyse this further we have to look to the original text where Herodotus himself states the above with some hesitance mentioning "ως εμοί δοκεί". The verb δοκεί means I think or, I hypothesize, or in the every day language "it looks like to me that...".

In contrast to "ως εμοί δοκεί", when Herodotus is certain for something he uses the phrase "ως εμοι καταφαίνεται είναι", which can be translated as "it is pretty clear, or it is obvious". For example he says: "Το δέ Ελληνικόν, γλώσσην μέν, επείτε εγένετο, αεί κοτε τή αυτή διαχράται, ώς εμοί καταφαίνεται είναι".

Credible scientist have long rejected the theories regarding the origin of the Hellenic Alphabet from the Phoenicians. Some of them are Auguste Fran&ccedil;ois Victor Jard&eacute; (in La Formation du Peuple Grec, Paris 1923, pg. 215), and the French philosopher Dussaut when in 1905 he postulated that the Phoenicians received the alphabet from the Cretans, and not that the Greeks received it from the Phoenicians. He further states that the Boioteans first placed the letter alpha sideways resembling the bull's head.

Dussaut's theorem is also supported by Evans who states in his book Scripta based on the similarity between the linear writing of the Cretans and the letters of the Phoenician alphabet that letters were transferred to Phoenicia and Palestine before or around 1300 BC by the immigrants Philistines (note the similarity between Philistine and Palestine!). Plutarch, furthermore, in his Symposiaka (Book Theta, problem B ) explains how the pronunciation of alpha derived from the prehistoric phonation of aaa! and not from the Phoenician aleph, and that first the Boioteans, as mentioned earlier, gave birth to the letter alpha when they placed the cow's head on its right.

Regarding Cadmus and his origin

Regarding Cadmus he was not of course of foreign origin, but an Hellene, returning from Phoenicia to Greece. It is well known from historical documentation that Phoenicia was formed from Greek immigrants in older times. If he was a foreigner his family would not be mentioned by Pindar in his Epinikeioi.

A similar example is that of Danaos, who returned from Egypt to Greece; all these have happened in older times before the Phoenicians were ever formed as a tribe. Diodorus Siculus is very illuminating regarding this matter, and in his book E (57) he states: "Aktis (son of Helios1 ) started his trip from Rhodes to Egypt and there he built Heliopolis, naming it after his father.” Even the most ignorant seeker of true historical facts will understand that it is a bizarre fact that one of the major ancient Egyptian cities would have a Hellenic name!!! “It was he, who taught the Egyptians the laws of astronomy. And when the flood came in Greece and most men died, the written archives were lost as well. And the Egyptians found the perfect chance to make the laws of astronomy and astrology their own. And since the Greeks because of (necessary) ignorance could not prove anything from a written source, the prevailed view was that the Egyptians discovered the laws of the stars. For these reasons, and these reasons only, many generations later Cadmo(u)s, the son of Aginoros was thought that he was the first to bring the letters back to Greece from Phoenicia.”

The main reason for confusion is caused due to the way the Greeks, even today, address other Greeks that lived for a long time outside Greece. The Greeks that were living from ancient times in Asia Minor before they were chased away by Turkey in the early 1900s are still today referred to as "Minor Asians" ("Μικρασιάτες"). Other Greeks that came back from Russia and in particular Efxinos Pontos (Black Sea) are today known as "Russian Pontians" ("Ρωσοπόντιοι") after they settled back in Macedonia. Although, there is no confusion among locals as to whether these people are Greek or not, much confusion results in the mind of a foreigner who listening to the names will believe that the above groups are not of Hellenic blood, but of Turkish and Russian respectively. For this exact reason Cadmus was originally thought that he was of Phoenician origin, whereas all above evidence points out that he was of Hellenic blood.

Evidence in Plato

Plato, well known to us and earlier than Diodorus in his dialogues Timaeus presents Kritias telling a story that he has heard from his grandfather regarding Solon, who has visited Egypt. Solon met a High Priest at Sais, who said to him: "In the first place you remember a single deluge only, but there were many previous ones; in the next place, you do not know that there formerly dwelt in your land the fairest and noblest race of men which ever lived, and that you and your whole city are descended from a small seed or remnant of them which survived. And this was unknown to you, because, for many generations, the survivors of that destruction died, leaving no written word. For there was a time, Solon, before the great deluge of all, when the city which now is Athens was first in war and in every way the best governed of all cities, is said to have performed the noblest deeds and to have had the fairest constitution of any of which tradition tells, under the face of heaven." (Plato Timaeus III,23). And then he continues: "You are welcome to hear about them, Solon, said the priest, both for your own sake and for that of your city, and above all, for the sake of the goddess who is the common patron and parent and educator of both our cities. She founded your city a thousand years before ours, receiving from the Gaia and Hephaestus the seed of your race, and afterwards she founded ours, of which the constitution is recorded in our sacred registers to be eight thousand years old. As touching your citizens of nine thousand years ago, I will briefly inform you of their laws and of their most famous action; the exact particulars of the whole we will hereafter go through at our leisure in the sacred registers themselves. If you compare these very laws with ours you will find that many of ours are the counterpart of yours as they were in the olden time."

Evidence from other ancient historians

It is obvious from the above information form Plato and Diodoros that the ancient Hellenes knew how to write and had the greatest of civilizations and it was them who transferred the knowledge to Egypt on their migration there, and not the other way around. Maybe we should add that Diodorus Siculus informs us that the letters have a divine origin, since they were given tio the Muses by Zeus Himself, and then the Muses gave them to men. Diodorus is writing (Book E, 74) "To the Muses it was given by their father (Zeus) the invention of letters and the combination of the words for the creation of poetry". He then continues regarding those who claim that the alphabet is of Phoenician origin: "the Phoenicians were not the first who invented the letters, but they simply changed the form of the letters". And then he continues (Book E, 78) "Minos established many laws at Crete, claiming that he received them from his father Zeus, with whom he was meeting inside a cave and was having discussions" It is then fairly simple to understand that the existence of laws among the Cretans from the very ancient of times, and therefore the existence of writing was proven by the archeological research and the finding of Linear A and B writing.

But the fact that the knowledge of writing existed among the Hellenes from the most ancient of times, long before the Phoenicians have made an appearance as a tribe is also the result of the ancient reports and information we have about the golden age of Kronos, king of the prehistoric Hellenes of the West. It was He that organized his subjects into a society, he set laws and set order and justice everywhere. One may easily comprehend that such actions can only be the by-product of writing. Diodorus Sicelus is writing again about Kronos, of Cretan origin “So, Kronos as him being the eldest became a king and made his subjects from savages civilized, and that is why everyone is accepting him, and he visited many places of the world. And wherever he went, he established justice and truth of sendiments. That is why the people of the era of Kronos were, according to tradition, kind, benevolent and happy. His kingdom was in basis in the west, where he received great honours. That is why, until the latest years Romans and Karchidoneans-when Karchidon existed- and other neighbour races were celebrating him in a big way and they held sacrifices for the honour of this God and many places were named after him. And with this outstanding obedience to the laws there was no crime at all, and all the subjects were living a happy life and were enjoying all the goods" (Historic Bookcase Book E, 66). It is fairly simple to understand that writing is necessary to establish laws into a society. Diodorus furthermore points out that Kronos (Saturn) was honoured by the Karchidoneans, obviously due to the them receiving the civilization by Him and everything associated with that, including the alphabet.

Diodorus Sicelus further illuminates us regarding the origin of alphabet as he probably had some surviving sections of the “Iera Anagrafi” of Euhmeros. The priests of Pagaia that were claiming Cretan origin and that they came with Zeus “were demonstaring inscriptions that confirmed those things that Zeus has done while he was still among the people" (Diodor. Sikel. Historic Bookcase E, 46).

The famous German Hermann Diltz / Dils in his biggest work “Presocratics” and his article regarding Orpheus claims that the ancient Greeks and Orpheans not only knew how to write but they were recording their observations and thoughts onto thin pieces of wood, that were copied to new pieces due to being erased by time, and when finally recorded by Peisistratos and Ipparxos, these texts on wood were left as unusable (Orphika by Ioannis Passas p 43).



Modern evidence regarding the origin of the Hellenic alphabet

The old (first) palace was built in around 2000 B.C. but it was completely destroyed by an earthquake in 1700 B.C. The new (second) palace, more complex in plan, strongly resembling a labyrinth, was constructed immediately afterwards. In the middle of the 15th century B.C. the Achaeans from the Greek Mainland conquered the island of Crete and settled at the palace of Knossos. They used the Greek language, as is indicated by the clay tablets they left, written in the Linear B script. The palace was again destroyed by fire in the mid-14th century B.C. (LM IIIA period) and ceased to function as a palatial centre.

Despite such a non-descriptive name, Linear B proved to be the oldest surviving record of the Greek dialect known as Mycenaean, named after the great site of Mycenae where the legendary Agamemnon ruled. The script's usage spanned the time period between approximately 1500 BCE and 1200 BCE , and geographically covered the island of Crete, as well as the southern part of the Greek Mainland.

Crete was the cradle of the Minoan Civilization, which spanned roughly from 2000 BCE to 1200 BCE. In addition to incredible frescoes, and indoor plumbing (!), the Minoans also developed the first written system of Europe. The oldest example of writing in Crete is a kind of "hieroglyphic" (which means that the signs are picture-like) script. The media where the hieroglyphic inscriptions appeared are mostly clay seal stones. The origin of the Cretan writing system lies in the extensive use of engraved seal stones, which depict physical objects, to (possibly) record quantities of these objects in soft clay. This forms a natural progression to a systematic writing system. As time progresses hieroglyphic system became more stylized and more linear. Instead of impressing seal stones in soft clay, the glyphs are incised on the soft clay with a stylus. In addition, quantities are represented by numerals (not multiple impressions of the same sign). As time goes on, it appears that the linear hieroglyphic system evolved into Linear A.

Linear A has roughly 90 symbols, thus most likely a syllabary much like Linear B. However, Linear A has resisted all attempts at decipherment because its underlying language is still unknown and probably will remain obscure since it doesn't seem to relate to any other surviving language in Europe or Western Asia. Linear B and Cypriot both exhibit considerable similarity to Linear A. Because of its time depth, Linear A appears to be the immediate ancestor to both of these writing systems. The hieroglyphic script appears only on seal stones and has yet to be deciphered. Linear A, also undeciphered, is thought to have evolved from the hieroglyphic script, and Linear B probably evolved from Linear A, though the relationship between the two scripts is unclear.

Evans figured out that short lines in Linear B texts were word dividers. He also deciphered the counting system and a number of pictograms, which led him to believe that the script was mainly pictographic. Evans also discovered a number of parallels between the Cypriot script, which had been deciphered, and Linear B. This indicated that the language represented by Linear B was an ancient form of Greek, but he wasn't prepared to accept this, being convinced that Linear B was used to write Minoan, a language unrelated to Greek.

In 1939, a large number of clay tablets inscribed with Linear B writing were found at Pylos on the Greek mainland, much to the surprise of Evans, who thought Linear B was used only on Crete. Michalis Ventris (1922-56) was the person who eventually deciphered Linear B in 1953. His interest was sparked in 1936 on a school trip to an exhibition about the Minoan world organised by Arthur Evans. For the next 17 years, Ventris struggled to understand Linear B. At first he was sceptical that the language of Linear B was Greek, even though many of the deciphered words resembled an archaic form of Greek. Later, with the help of John Chadwick, an expert on early Greek, he showed beyond reasonable doubt the Linear B did indeed represent Greek.





1: Helios: Greek name for Sun

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